To-do list:
- Merge Furry Webcomic and Furry Comic into UsefulNotes.Furry Fandom.
OP credits go to Amathieu 13
In terms of these two indices on their own, there isn't much of a difference between comic/webcomic and neither page is all that long to begin with, so I'm not sure why they are separated into two anyways. At a minimum, these two should be merged.
But if you consider the outcome of such a merge—Furry Works, essentially—it makes it clear that this would then be a duplicate with Popular with Furries. A likely counter argument is that "Popular with Furries includes works that weren't intended to be popular with furries but just are, often because they use World of Funny Animals, in addition to works explicitly created for furries. These indices are for works intentionally made for furries." But two things:
- differentiating between "what's intended" and "what's not" is hard without Word of God. In lieu of that requirement, people are seemingly using whether or not the work is set in a World of Funny Animals as a proxy to determine whether the work is in the furry "genre" or not. And because of that...
- in practice both Furry Comic and Furry Webcomics include works that aren't explicitly claimed to be created for furries, something that has been brought up at least once before on the Furry Webcomics discussion page [1]
, making the argument that intentional/unintentional is a meaningful difference moot.
To this second point, Fritz the Cat, The Adventures of Captain Jack, and Geronimo Stilton are all listed on Furry Comic.
- On Fritz the Cat's page, it's noted that it is considered a predecessor of the Furry Fandom, but that doesn't mean it was intentionally made to be a part of it; in fact, since the fandom didn't even exist, you could argue that it's impossible for it to have been.
- Nothing on Captain Jack's page even mentions being for furries and the only thing that seems to justify its inclusion is the anthropomorphic animal leads, similar to many Tex Avery MGM Cartoons which is likely part of its inspo since it also makes use of Slapstick.
- And Geronimo Stilton, being a children's series, almost certainly wasn't made for furries.
I'd personally label all 3 as misuse. But how we determine what qualifies as part of a "furry genre" and whether that's redundant with World of Funny Animals and Popular with Furries is exactly the issue. Way I see it, either these indices are just collections of comics and webcomics set in World of Funny Animals without having been intended to be furry works by the creator (which if then they should just be on that page) or these are works that are considered Popular with Furries because they are set in World of Funny Animals and/or have anthropomorphised animals in prominent roles, so they should be merged there.
Recommendation: If people disagree with my read on things re: in practice, these two aren't different from Popular with Furries or World of Funny Animals despite what they say, then I guess, we can just merge the two together. But if people agree
- Option 1: Cut both and move examples over to either Popular with Furries or World of Funny Animals
- Option 2: redirect both to one of the two.
- Option 3: Turn one of the pages into a disambig and redirect the other to it.
Personally prefer 1 over all, but any of the bottom 3 solutions are ok with me. As for which trope to move examples to if we cut or redirected, I'd rather it be to World of Funny Animals, since I actually don't get the tropeworthiness of Popular with Furries—is there any other niche community that we have an entire YMMV page dedicated to works that may appeal to them? That said, that's a critique for a separate thread. Either would be fine.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 18th 2023 at 5:34:39 AM
I'll give it a look over in an hour or so.
I'd like to apologize for all this.
I think I'd rather keep the blurbs to show how the works are relevant to furry fandom. Not everything by furry creators features anthropomorphic animals. Ursula Vernon, for instance, has a lot of books about human characters. [1] [2]
Edited by Twiddler on Aug 1st 2023 at 3:03:01 AM
Kemono Cafe and The Katbox are listed, even though they are websites, not webcomics.
I'd like to apologize for all this.Other question: do we need the red links? They're not against the rules, but they're complicating cleanup since I have nothing as reference.
I'd like to apologize for all this.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
red links for work pages and creator pages are encouraged across the site to get people to make the pages.
then those two are in the wrongname space since they're listed under Webcomic.Kemono Cafe and Webcomic.The Katbox.
I'd ask for a mod to move them to the Website namespace, but looking at the pages, neither seem to actually have tropes on them, just lists of works they used to host. If someone who knows more about the sites can list 3 tropes, then we can salvage them. Otherwise, they're stubs and have to be cut.
I don't think an author's name means they only write furry works. Neil Gaiman is listed on Gothic Horror, but has written works across many genre. That said, we could re-title the author section to make that clearer
Edited by amathieu13 on Aug 1st 2023 at 11:22:24 AM
the Retromancer
What does "Works produced by members of the furry fandom" mean, that the creators have to identify as being in the community? Thinking the index may attract wicks for World of Funny Animals but aren't related to the fandom.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
This should definitely list only self-identified works.
Correct. It is.
This was my concern (and why I personally wanted to merge into World of Funny Animals), but crowner voted to keep the list and move to the useful notes page with the caveat that the works have to be self-identified as for furries. Merge was an option it just wasn't the most popular.
Edited by amathieu13 on Aug 1st 2023 at 11:36:00 AM
the Retromancer
Which is also an issue related to redlinks. It'd be hard to check if the works fit the list without the info.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
I mean, that's not an issue exclusive to this index. That's just an issue with red links on indices in general. We operate on good faith that those who put red links down on indices are correctly classifying the work.
And barring the work being scrubbed from the internet, you can verify it if you search off the site for it. We just don't have a page for it on site.
Edited by amathieu13 on Aug 1st 2023 at 11:46:00 AM
Webcomic.Kemono Cafe and Webcomic.The Katbox could potentially be moved to the Platform/ namespace that's been formally approved (in this thread) but hasn't actually gotten off the ground yet.
I'm talking about the work listings, not the creator listings. A creator being a furry shouldn't mean everything they've ever made is fair game to add to the index, just the stuff that features anthropomorphic animals. That's why I'd rather keep the work blurbs. (And reword the work section header, come to think of it.)
Edited by Twiddler on Aug 1st 2023 at 10:58:42 AM
That should be discussed in that forum then. For now, I removed them from the index.
RE: the blurbs, the two sandboxes still have them so feel free to move those over. Like i said, I removed them for uniformity purposes since if I kept them, only the webcomics folder would've had them.
They should get a pass-through before adding, though, since a lot of them had irrelevant info like whether they were still updating or not, which may or may not even be true anymore depending on the last time the indices were updated. And many of them weren't blurbs, but links to the work offsite, which I'm not sure what our policy is for that (especially for NSFW works for which there are many in this index in particular)
Edited by amathieu13 on Aug 1st 2023 at 2:18:09 PM
If the work page exists then an external link is superfluous, since the work page should have the link, but red link + external link is fine.
NSFW works are fine to link to as long as anyone following the link is given adequate warning and nothing NSFW is directly linked to. For example, Ménage à 3's first strip is NSFW, so for a long time its page linked to the second strip instead (with an explanation). Now there's a SFW "for new readers" page before the first strip, so our page links to that instead.
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
Clock expired, so locking up.
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Crown Description:
In terms of Furry Webcomic and Furry Comic on their own, there isn't much of a difference between comic/webcomic and neither page is all that long to begin with, so there have been concerns that they're redundant with each other, and there have been concerns that the two are redundant with World Of Funny Animals. What should be done with Furry Webcomic and Furry Comic?.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]")
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