Nrjxll brought up that we don't have a politics thread for this region, so here it is. This is a thread discussing events in Northern Europe, which includes Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Iceland, Latvia, Lithuania, Norway and Sweden. Ireland and the United Kingdom can also be included, though the UK has it's own politics thread
, so events related solely to them should be discussed there instead. To start, the UK has pledged to support Sweden and Finland if the countries come under attack by Russia.
Edited by CookingCat on Oct 20th 2022 at 4:57:26 AM
Fun fact France and Canada may share a land border on a uninhabited island near Newfoundland, but the two countries don't agree on this.
(And that sounds quite pointless).
‘No Way to Say’ When Turkey Will Release Hold on Sweden, Finland, Says NATO’s Stoltenberg
“The progress is maybe just the fact that we have open lines. We continue discussions,” he said during a press conference Sunday. “I don’t see any major differences in the way Finland deals with Turkey’s terrorism issue if you compare it to other existing NATO countries. So that makes [it] a bit difficult to understand that we are pointed out.”
"...Stuck in the middle with you"
Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
NATO invites Finland, Sweden to join, says Russia is a 'direct threat'
"Today, we have decided to invite Finland and Sweden to become members of NATO," NATO leaders said in their declaration, after Turkey lifted a veto on Finland and Sweden joining.
Ratification in allied parliaments is likely to take up to a year, but once it is done, Finland and Sweden will be covered by NATO's Article 5 collective defence clause, putting them under the United States' protective nuclear umbrella.
Goku Black
Guess The Putin plan to stop the "spread of NATO" hasn't worked out....
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
I actually wanted to be Resileaf
Yeah, it's like starting a war of aggression and getting your ass kicked is counterproductive or something.
Saber rattling aside, Russia almost certainly expected this to happen and thought it was worth it (given that those two countries were considered NATO in all but name anyway from Moscow's perspective). A foolish calculation to be sure, but not the same thing as being blindsided.
Honestly, I've increasingly leaned towards the position that NATO expansion wasn't really a main factor in the invasion in the first place. It wasn't nonexistent, but Putin in particular seems really fundamentally opposed to the existence of Ukraine as an independent state regardless of whether it's in NATO or not.
So while unwelcome I wouldn't really say Finland and Sweden joining is actually proof that the war was counterproductive, because I'm not convinced that stopping NATO expansion was ever more than a smokescreen.
A Self-inflicted Disaster
About Sweden and Finland joining NATO, did they have to make any concessions to Turkiye?
"Enshittification truly is how platforms die"-Cory Doctorow
According to what I heard, yes:
https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1541856195257966592
Joint Declaration is here.
The conditions:
- Sweden/Finland will lift its arms embargo
- Both will support Turkey on PKK, stop support to YPG (remember that the coalition fighting ISIL is partnering with the YPG)
- They will amend their laws on terrorism
- They will share Intel with each other
- They will extradite terror suspects
- Finland and Sweden will support Turkey’s participation to EU’s Pesko
- Turkey, Finland and Sweden will establish a permanent joint mechanism to consult on justice, security and intelligence
Edited by Ominae on Jun 29th 2022 at 8:53:58 AM
Turkey’s Erdoğan threatens to derail Nato enlargement again
Long story short, the memorandum is so vague and has no legally binding elements, that the countries can pretty much interpret it willy-nilly. Even the Finnish foreign minister and president were a bit surprised that the Turks just sort of folded after a simple language change in the memorandum, which comes with no real costs to Finland whatsoever.
Yeah, we'll be here for a while. Thanks for the invite though.
Edited by TerminusEst on Jun 30th 2022 at 11:40:37 AM
Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
Yeah I had wondered if he would try it.
Basically until the final vote itself happens, it ain't over.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Article's paywalled. Think you could please quoteblock it?
Princess Martha Louise of Norway is already set to marry Durek Verrett, American businessman, alternative therapist, self-professed shaman and author. He's been criticized in some parts of Norway to be a conman.
The princess is set to not use her royal titles while she manages the alternative medicine business with Durek.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66804252
People don't like Durek since he's trying to con his way to the Norwegian royal family.
Sounds bad, but does this actually have an impact on regular people? The royals don't actually do that much. Norway is such a small country I don't think their royal family has much of a media presence to begin with, so you couldn't rly argue that this would result in homeopathy becoming more popular
All I know is the normal people do have some qualms on the guy (he did speak on using alternative treatments for COVID). Unofficial reports that I have heard suggest that parts of the royal family don't even like the guy, mostly due to his shady past.
Well, it reflects badly on politicians if they promote alt-med, and them being figurehead monarchs does not really make it better.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
From last year, there's (reported) 80% support of the royal family and the Norwegians won't like it if the guy who does promote alt medicine makes it mainstream.
But what makes it safe (for now) is that the guy has accepted the fact that he won't get royal titles from Harald V.
The (current) Chinese-owned (has Hong Kong flag) Newnew Polar Bear is under Finnish investigation as it was sent loitering around the area where the Finnish Balticconnector pipeline got damaged. Finnish Border Guard said a heavy object was found in the sea next to the pipeline.
A Russian ship, Sevmorput, was also in the area too.
https://nitter.net/visegrad24/status/1715371239026339841
Visegrad 24 has a map of the Newnewbear's path. Also showed the rescue submarine ship H Sw MS Belos in the area, surveying the damage done to the pipeline.
he/him
Norway has officially recognised the state of Palestine (as part of a coordinated announcement with Ireland and Spain).
Israel has withdrawn its ambassador in protest, warned of "severe consequences" and stated that it will reprimand the Norwegian ambassador to Israel and "show them a video of female hostages being held in captivity by Hamas".
Note: Discussion of Israel and Palestine is currently prohibited in the forums
, as it's been impossible to keep the conversation calm due to recent events. This announcement is on-topic for Norwegian politics and can be covered here, wider discussion of Israel and/or Palestine is not permitted.
So...Every continent except Australia and Antarctica now has a land border with at least one European country.